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Location: Machynlleth, Mid Wales | I think some of the "public" responses are symptomatic of our risk-averse culture, which is a bit contradictory really when you consider the massive risks we all allow our governments and financial institutions to take on our behalf. The quest for adventure will never die in Mankind while there are people like the 3000 who entered this event. Cheers - John |
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Location: Southeast Essex | It cries; 'Nanny State'
Meanwhile, the walkers walk off the mountain with no problem.
When will the authorities learn that individuals are free to choose what they wish to do and when to do it. Its not a school playground where authorities pretend that they are responsible for everyone.
When the shite hits the fan and someone in authority is actually culpable they run for a mile, duck and dive and never want to be responsible.
Oh and another thing; How many times did we hear reports yesterday of authorities bleating on about their worries about people caught on the hills and mountains in the floods!!! I always thought that the safest place to be is on high ground when there is a risk of flooding!! What a daft bunch of sausages!
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Location: Machynlleth, Mid Wales | Good lord! Vill and I in full agreement for a change! Cheers - John |
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Location: Southeast Essex | John, you and I have a great deal in common and will actually see eye to eye on most things. I know that, but you dont!  |
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Location: Machynlleth, Mid Wales | Village - 27/10/2008 08:50 John, you and I have a great deal in common and will actually see eye to eye on most things. I know that, but you dont! ;)  Cheers - John |
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Location: North Wales | Andy Mayhew - 25/10/2008 21:39 I have to say that given conditions on Thursday and the forecast for today I had reservations about the event going ahead. My forecast: With ground already saturated, some flooding looks very likely. Coupled with the low cloud and gales it is definitely not a day for the hills! What conclusion did you reach? I'd like to think that with an event like this each individual will make a choice based on their knowledge of the weather forecasts and experience. It's not like a fun run for people who normally run only when the sun shines.
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Location: Tonbridge, Kent. 44m ASL | It's all very well saying people should be allowed take risks they choose except when Mountain Rescue Services - who are volunteers - are called out and possibly made to put their own lives in danger. In this case those out on the mountains were experienced and well prepared but that not's always the case. There are numerous instances of foolish and inexperienced people walking into mountains ludicrously underprepared and making cellphone calls to the rescue services expecting help when the weather turns dangerous. Sometimes people do need to be protected from their own idiocy without the unthinking kneejerk reflex call of "nanny state". |
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Location: Dartmoor, Devon | Big Dave's Gusset - 27/10/2008 09:42 It's all very well saying people should be allowed take risks they choose except when Mountain Rescue Services - who are volunteers - are called out and possibly made to put their own lives in danger. In this case those out on the mountains were experienced and well prepared but that not's always the case. There are numerous instances of foolish and inexperienced people walking into mountains ludicrously underprepared and making cellphone calls to the rescue services expecting help when the weather turns dangerous. Sometimes people do need to be protected from their own idiocy without the unthinking kneejerk reflex call of "nanny state". Well put. I'm not surprised this has gone political, though it's surprising how long it took... |
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Location: Ferryhill, Co Durham (6 miles S of Durham City) | I think the whole thing has been misrepresented by the media. They reported 1,000+ people as being 'unaccounted for'. In media terms this infers death. The fact that most people got off without a problem because they were well prepared doesn't really merit a mention because it's not news. The whole event was well organised and they had 40 years experience of it. The people involved were all kitted out with the right equipment and knew what was involved. The organisers had also provided emergency routes off in case of difficulty. The race was also an endurance race, man against the elements, not a stroll in the park. The people who take part in these things are also the most enthusiastic contributors to mountain rescue teams, so no argument there. Everyone knew what they were doing and no-one forced them to do it. Any emergency services called out were no more at risk than anyone else because they have the right equipment and are prepared for the eventualities. Once again, 'risking their lives' is a bit of an exaggeration (and no-one forces them to do it either). The police are always great at being wise after the event as well aren't they?
The bigger question is, who decides we need saving from ourselves? |
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Location: Dartmoor, Devon | dko - 27/10/2008 10:05 I think the whole thing has been misrepresented by the media. They reported 1,000+ people as being 'unaccounted for'. In media terms this infers death. The fact that most people got off without a problem because they were well prepared doesn't really merit a mention because it's not news. The whole event was well organised and they had 40 years experience of it. The people involved were all kitted out with the right equipment and knew what was involved. The organisers had also provided emergency routes off in case of difficulty. The race was also an endurance race, man against the elements, not a stroll in the park. The people who take part in these things are also the most enthusiastic contributors to mountain rescue teams, so no argument there. Everyone knew what they were doing and no-one forced them to do it. Any emergency services called out were no more at risk than anyone else because they have the right equipment and are prepared for the eventualities. Once again, 'risking their lives' is a bit of an exaggeration (and no-one forces them to do it either). The police are always great at being wise after the event as well aren't they? The bigger question is, who decides we need saving from ourselves? Another excellent post - two in a few minutes  Btw, good to see you posting Dave  |
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Location: Brecon Beacons, Wales, UK. 1,100' ASL | But there is a fine line, the emergency services, i understand, were called out (in the first instance) by people in the race who couldn't cope with the conditions and were taken to hospital suffering from hypothermia. |
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Location: North Wales | Big Dave's Gusset - 27/10/2008 09:42 It's all very well saying people should be allowed take risks they choose except when Mountain Rescue Services - who are volunteers - are called out and possibly made to put their own lives in danger. In this case those out on the mountains were experienced and well prepared but that not's always the case. There are numerous instances of foolish and inexperienced people walking into mountains ludicrously underprepared and making cellphone calls to the rescue services expecting help when the weather turns dangerous. Sometimes people do need to be protected from their own idiocy without the unthinking kneejerk reflex call of "nanny state". What I was trying to say was, I feel this was a different type of event from a sponsored hill walk. Rather than an event for anyone who feels strongly about whatever cause it is chosing to walk up, say Snowdon, inspite of not have walked a mountain before, I think most/all of the people in this event were "mountain smart" enough to know their limits and check weather forecasts. So I felt the criteria for cancellation should be a little higher. |
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Location: Dartmoor, Devon | Uskys - 27/10/2008 10:09 But there is a fine line, the emergency services, i understand, were called out (in the first instance) by people in the race who couldn't cope with the conditions and were taken to hospital suffering from hypothermia. It is a fine line so it's not simply nanny state nonsense.
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Executive
Location: Evesham, Worcs | The emergency services were needed because when the people came down off the hill they found their cars were under 4 foot of water and/or were cut off by floods. They could not get home - and thus had to take shelter until they could be 'rescued'. That should have been anticipated and is why the event should perhaps not have gone ahead.
They were fine whilst out on the hill .....
I understand there was 1 injury and a handful of cases of minor hypothermia (apparently ITV reported a total of 13 people requiring medical attention)
I wonder if 2,500 people played rugby on Saturday, how many would afterwards require medical attention? |
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Location: Runcorn, near Liverpool 2008 Capital of Culture | I wish those who want to protect us from ourselves would turn their attention to the great god Car. All of us, drivers and non-drivers alike, are every day exposed to enormous involuntary risk every time we step out of our front doors.
Those runners knew exactly what they were letting themselves in for and took a calculated risk, just as I do when I wade into an icy river or lake in the depths of winter in just my cozzie.
Pete |
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Location: Ferryhill, Co Durham (6 miles S of Durham City) | That's fair enough USkys, but who decides they should not have had that choice?
The emergency services' first priority is to ensure their own safety before any rescue is attempted, so they don't actually 'risk their own lives' at all. Let's be quite clear about that. The types of people that take part in these events are experienced people, not your average rambler. They take part because it's a challenge. They contribute to fell rescue teams because they know that some day they might need them, so I think it's fair enough that they can call on them when needed. The media whipped this up into something it wasn't and they should be taken to task for it. |
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Location: Ferryhill, Co Durham (6 miles S of Durham City) | Andy Mayhew - 27/10/2008 10:26
I wonder if 2,500 people played rugby on Saturday, how many would afterwards require medical attention?
Great point, well made. |
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Location: Tonbridge, Kent. 44m ASL | dko - 27/10/2008 10:30
That's fair enough USkys, but who decides they should not have had that choice?
The emergency services' first priority is to ensure their own safety before any rescue is attempted, so they don't actually 'risk their own lives' at all. Let's be quite clear about that. The types of people that take part in these events are experienced people, not your average rambler. They take part because it's a challenge. They contribute to fell rescue teams because they know that some day they might need them, so I think it's fair enough that they can call on them when needed. The media whipped this up into something it wasn't and they should be taken to task for it.
I'll reiterate that I don't have an issue in this particular case because of the very reasons you state but where do you then draw the line between responsible and irresponsible behaviour? If reckless idiots want to put their own lives in danger by all means let them do it - let's thin out the gene pool Darwin Award style - so long as they don't impose their suicidal idiocy on others. But in this case the vast majority of those involved I'm sure wouldn't have expected to be the subject of a the usual media feeding frenzy. |
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Location: Two Mile Ash, Milton Keynes, 95m amsl | The BBC ran this story as its main headline on the news last night, and presented it as a major and dramatic rescue. It was obviously a quiet news day. They blew this story up way out of proportion to its importance. All of the runners were equiped to deal with the conditions that were likely to occur, and all of them would have been aware of the weather forecast. This is just another example of the media (and not just the BBC) completely misunderstanding the subject matter.
The BBC news failed to mention that two of its well paid "stars" find it funny to leave offensive messages on the answerphone of an OAP.
As has been mentioned before on this Forum, the BBC needs to raise its game......and soon. |
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Location: Southeast Essex | Peter H - 27/10/2008 09:59 Big Dave's Gusset - 27/10/2008 09:42 It's all very well saying people should be allowed take risks they choose except when Mountain Rescue Services - who are volunteers - are called out and possibly made to put their own lives in danger. In this case those out on the mountains were experienced and well prepared but that not's always the case. There are numerous instances of foolish and inexperienced people walking into mountains ludicrously underprepared and making cellphone calls to the rescue services expecting help when the weather turns dangerous. Sometimes people do need to be protected from their own idiocy without the unthinking kneejerk reflex call of "nanny state". Well put. I'm not surprised this has gone political, though it's surprising how long it took... Political? Have you been reading the same thread as everyone else? |
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Floods strand hundreds of runners 25th Ocober
